SEPHORA goes Web3: First-Hand Insights from Vincent Benoist

[upbeat music] Welcome to another show from 51 Insights. I'm very excited to have here Vincent Benoit.

He's the global innovation project director at Sephora. Um, Vincent, welcome to the podcast. Thank you, Marc. Very happy to be, uh, with you today, and, uh, glad we finally, uh, made it. Yeah, exactly.

Where, where are you tuning, tuning in from? I'm, uh, I'm in Paris actually at the moment. The, the local- In Paris. Yeah, the, the, the global team of Sephora is based in Paris. Uh, we do travel a lot.

We've got, uh, innovation teams, innovation teams across the globe, uh, North America, uh, Europe, Middle East, Asia, China. Uh, but the global team is, is, uh, located in, uh, in Paris. Only a few people know it.

I mean, not, not a few, but, um, people tend to think that Sephora is a, is a American brand, but, uh, Sephora is actually a French brand. Yeah, exactly.

Also, Sephora is a, a French multinational retailer for the ones- Yes... who, who are not familiar with the brand, focused on care and beauty products, founded in 1969 in France. That's right. Yes. Yeah. Exactly.

And, and, uh- Yeah, we've got a long history and, and from the very beginning, Sephora was, um, an innovator.

Uh, we, our founder, Monsieur Dominique Mandonnaud, uh, broke all the codes, uh, launching a new way to sell products and cosmetic products, beauty products. You know, um, um,

in, at that, at that time, if you wanted to spray perfume, Chanel perfume, fragrance, uh, smell it, you, you had to go to a Chanel boutique, to a Dior boutique. Um, uh, and it, it could be intimidating, you know?

And, uh, he decided to, to, to kind of make this much more accessible, and the accessibility was at the core of Sephora concept, and that, and that's how Sephora was, was created.

Uh, bringing those products available to everyone who entered the, the, the store.

Still today, you know, you can feel like, uh, uh, you, you could go in a Sephora store, spray yourself, uh, put makeup on, um, try the, um, the nail polish, et cetera, and, and that's fine, and that, that's actually great, and that's what make the experience so delightful in our stores.

And people actually spend quite some time in our store because they, they, they love this. And, and so from the founding, fr-from the foundation day to today, Sephora innovated and is still innovating. Mm-hmm.

Yeah, and just to give you a, a couple of numbers that are very, very impressive, Sephora operates, uh, over 2,700 stores in 35 countries, uh, globally. Um, Sephora makes about 10 billions in revenue every year.

Uh, they carry over 340 brands, and, um, they have about 25 million active members in their loyalty program. Yeah, that, so those numbers- Yeah. Yeah.

We, we, we, we're usually super shy, and we are super shy in terms of sharing those numbers. Um, but yeah, ballpark, uh, tho-those numbers are, are, um, about right. Um,

we are, uh, indeed a, a, um, international retailer. Um, we are, uh, we carry multiple brands, uh, exclusive brands. That's what makes us, uh, very, uh, um,

liked by our customer base is because, and our beauty fans, is because they can find some brands that they can, that can only be found at Sephora, and we carry those brands very, very proudly.

And you can also find selective brands, um, a-as well, and you've got also our own brand, Sephora Collection. Um, and, and so, uh, we,

yeah, we, we proudly carry the, the, those, those brands, uh, curated brands, uh, across the globe, um, to spread beauty and, uh, you know, to, uh, uh, really, um,

bring those values around inclusivity, around diversity, and the fact that, uh, beauty has so many faces, and we, we carry those values very proudly, uh, across the globe.

And, uh, not only that, you also recently, uh, in February this year, launched Sephora Universe, which is your, uh, uh, acclaimed Web3 activation. It made a lot of waves.

Uh, it's a virtual world and experience where users have their own a-avatar. They can discover virtual products. They can attend virtual experiences. But, uh, I'll let you introduce it by yourself, Vincent.

What is Sephora Universe, uh, for those people who don't know it? Right. Sephora Universe is, is quite simple. It's our-- So first of all, it's a, it's a beta, it's a prototype, right? Uh, it's our, um,

that's how Sephora tried to bring, uh, um, and to test a new way to discover products and to discover brands online.

Uh, the discovery of brands and products online at the moment is quite limited to either social network or websites, but remains quite traditional.

What we wanted to explore and test with this prototype is a much more immersive, fun, uh, and accessible way to discover those products and those brands, uh, through, uh, uh, um, 3D, uh, like a, a 3D world.

It's like a Sephora world.

So we brought, um, and we translated the DNA of Sephora, uh, into a, a immersive and virtual world where you can actually play, uh, you can engage, you can interact with, uh, products, with brands, and by doing so, you learn interesting things.

Uh, you have fun and spend a good time, and you can win some rewards. Um, so we, we tried really to have a very exhaustive approach to, uh, what at the time, and still today, we can

call the metaverse, um, and the blockchain, but not for the sake of using those technologies. We wanted to bring value to our customers

by enabling a new form, again, of, of, uh, experience online. You know, we, we, we usually say, "Oh, I had a, uh, I had a good cus- this is a good customer experience." We talk about customer experience.

Customer experience in store makes a lot of sense, right?

It's you, you had a good time, you had a good advice, you talked to a beauty advisor, you, you found the right product, uh, it smelled good, and, uh, and the music was cool, and et cetera.

The customer experience online is usually much more transactional, meaning that, uh, it was easy to find a product, um, it was available, um,

you managed to add to the cart, uh, to, to finalize your transaction.

But so it's, the approach online to date is much more around you didn't have any trouble along the way rather than you actually spent a good time and you had a memorable experience because it lacks a bit emotion, right?

So this project is all about bringing the joy, bringing the, the, the, the sense of delight that you can experience in our stores, uh, in the r- in the digital realm, right?

Um, and, and, and also by, by maintaining the accessibility of, of our website, um, and the fact that it's super inclusive, super accessible, and super easy to, to discover.

So really that is the objective of this project. Yeah. And I remember last time we talked, you mentioned something about the time a customer spends with your brand. Right. Uh, there's- Yeah, yeah. That's this notion-...

could you elaborate on that a bit? Yeah, sure. That's this notion of

on one side having something very exploratory and, and our customers in, at least in the flagship store, right, the, the biggest, largest stores that we have, on average, uh, they can spend up to 45 minutes, uh,

just wandering around and trying the products and, and, and having fun.

Uh, whether online, um, I mean, it depend on the website or the app, the average time is a bit different, but roughly speaking, you're looking at less than, than anywhere between, you know, around five minutes.

And, and so much more transactional. Um, and, and so we wanted to... Yeah, we really wanted to know if there is a white space and, and if there is a place in the middle.

Like can people, will people spend 10, 15 minutes online having fun, um, where they can discover, uh, new products and, and brands and, you know, it's Mother's Day, it's, uh, end of year, it's, you know, um, Halloween, whatever that is for, for those, uh, key moments, um, could they, could they spend some time discovering, playing, engaging with each others around beauty?

Mm-hmm.

And before we jump into the specifics of how you did that, I would like to take a step back and, and ask you, because we, we already, uh, mentioned that word a couple of times, and, and I think it's, it's important to define that.

We talk about Web3 a lot. What do you understand, um, what's your understanding of that word? What's Web3 for you, and why should pe- Mm.... people care? I come from a non-technical background. I mean,

I can understand, but I'm not a tech-savvy person. I don't consider myself as, as, as a, as a tech person.

That being said, Web3 to me is-- And that's why Web3 to me needs to be anchored and, and tied to real tangible benefits. Um,

when we started this project, we thought about doing things the old way, uh, but we said, "No, let's take this opportunity to test, to understand how it works, and to

appreciate how this technology can unlock new opportunities." New opportunities around user-generated content, that's, that's the first one.

New opportunities around relationship, um, and direct relationship between our beauty fans, between, uh, our brands, and with Sephora, this kind of, you know, um, uh, tripartite, uh, uh, uh, relationship.

Um, and understanding opportunities around, uh, uh, value of digital asset, meaning like could we

in, in potentially in the future imagine a world where you could actually, uh, uh, have a, a makeup look, uh, uh, create your own makeup look,

uh, share it with the community Digital, uh, ava— on the, and, and wear it on digital avatars, and maybe this could, uh, have value, uh, monetary value. You could sell it, you could transfer it. Um,

um, so that was also something we wanted to, to explore. And the last, uh, thing we wanted to, to, to explore on Web3 is this notion of community and the, the sense of membership, the sense of belonging.

Because you own the token, uh, because you are a, a, a owner of this digital asset, then it can unlock,

uh, specific exclusive access, exclusive rewards, uh, the possibility to, uh, interact in a different way. And, and that, for us, was really, again, in-interesting and really tied to, to what Sephora is about.

Uh, you talked about our, uh, huge, loyal, uh, loyal m-m-member, uh, base. That is also something we wanted to, to better understand. So to me, Web3, in a, [chuckles]

in a short way, because that was a long answer, Web3 is all about new opportunities, uh, um, and it's about,

um, uh, uh, generating value and bringing this value in the hands of our, uh, customers.

Uh, l-last time we spoke, you also mentioned that, and I found that very interesting, that you took a very broad approach at the beginning of the project, looking at v- at various different technologies.

Can you el-elaborate a little bit on that process of refining down what you would really like to focus on- Hmm... with Sephora Universe?

Yeah, because you have to keep in mind, we started thinking about this project, like, almost two years ago. Um, Facebook just at the time became Meta.

Uh, there was the hype around Web3, metaverse, and, and, and so we, of course, looked at this and, and, and thought, well, how should we approach that? And, and

not approach this in a way to just, you know, uh, speculate, but approach this, again, around how this can deliver value to our customers, how this can be interesting for our clients, and, and how for beauty and beauty brands, this can be a, an opportunity to, to, um, uh, drive superior engagement, um, attention, and, and excitement.

So with that in mind, then you've got everything open. Like, um, you know, how should we approach this? Should, should this virtual world be a boutique? Um, should we have beauty advisors as well?

Um, what, what should people do? Do we need an avatar? This avatar, should it look human, or does it need to be like a horse or [chuckles] whatever that is? Um, so everything was, was processed,

and, and what kept us honest or focused was this vision, um, the vision that we wanted to delight our customers and that we wanted to be true to our DNA. Uh, so in order to do that,

first of all, we were very lucky to be s- uh, uh, uh, supported by, by a startup, a very visionary startup around Web3 and metaverse.

Uh, and if you allow me, the startup is, uh, BlackPixel, and really, they were super strong in guiding us, framing those elements.

Uh, as I mentioned, I didn't know anything about Web3, about wallets, about, uh, metaverse, et cetera, so framing the discussion was, was very important for us at the beginning.

And then we were also super, super lucky to, um, uh, bring back the former, uh, architect and artistic director of Sephora, the one who created, you know, the, the stripes, I mean, the ones that are behind me, and, and the flame, Sephora flame, but also the one of our most iconic flagship, which is the Champs-Élysées store.

Um, so we were very lucky to work again with him after so many years.

Uh, so he could, you know, keep us on track around what Sephora is all about, remind us of the time where Monsieur Dominique Mandonnaud, our founder, uh, started Sephora and what was important to him, and, and,

and then translating this DNA and this vision into, quite quickly into a prototype. And so the prototype really helped us by-- because we had to make some choices.

And so I think we had, we needed a forcing constraint to help us focus. So the vision was one thing, the DNA was very important, and then the prototype, uh, enabled us to make those, those choices.

I think if I remember correctly, I think we identified more than 100 or 120 use cases around what people could do in those type of metaverse d-dedicated to beauty.

So quite huge, as, as you can imagine, but the prototype really forced us to, to focus. And, and what did you do with that prototype? How did you test it?

We wanted to start with the ultimate vision, um, which is, uh, using a headset, a virtual reality headset. This is

still to this day, uh, the best way to be immersed in, in an experience, in a virtual experience, is to use a, a, a, a VR headset. Um, so that's what we did.

Um, we, we forgot about all the constraint, technical constraint were, were put aside. Let's say you could do everything and anything, what would you do? What would be the best thing to do in this world? Um,

the prototyping was actually quite short. I think it took us two to three, three months max to just build that first, uh, virtual reality prototype, enabling us then

to, um, socialize and to share this internally and to show.

And because once people-- If you, if you t- if you talk about the metaverse and say, "Oh, it's a place to discover beauty and, and it's gonna be so much fun," and people are like, "Yeah, I don't know."

Once you put the headset on and you say, "Okay, click on this, take the product, put it to your face.

Oh, I'm inside the product, and then I can almost smell it," and then, "Okay, go to this space, you, and, and play this game. Oh, I can do this." And it becomes just the emotion is then

inside you, and you remember, yeah, metaverse can actually be quite good.

And I had a good time, and I actually learned that in this formula there are lemons, because I had to grab so many lemons, uh, in this game that I will remember forever that this hydration cream is, is, formula is made out of lemons.

So I think that's how we realized. We tested with more than 100 people, this, this prototype internally and with our brand partners, and it was complete massive success.

Like I think out of the 100, I think 95 people told us like, "Wow, this is, this is great. Let's, yeah, let's do it." So, um, a great, the best way to, to, to convince is actually to show and, and to test.

Um, so that, that's why it was so important for us to, to have this quite quickly out, and then it helped us a lot in terms of refining and, and, and... But at least we knew. We knew it was already a success.

We just had to prioritize and, and then integrate the technical constraints that we, we put away by, by doing this prototype on the, uh, as a standalone. Mm-hmm.

Uh, that sounds great, especially how you, how you won that internal support and how you went out with the prototype to, to, to different stakeholders within the company.

Uh, what, what were some or I would say the, the biggest challenges you need to, needed to overcome when, when launching that product? Reminding yourself why you do this and

what is the objective that, that you're, you're, um, working towards. I think that was, that was very important, so, and a, and a, and a healthy challenge from everyone. Like, okay, this is cool, but, you know, what's,

what's the purpose? [chuckles] And, and so we had to tie, always to tie this back to the value that I was talking about, uh, the metrics that we wanted to measure, and, uh, the criteria of success.

Uh, so that was the main challenge. The other challenge was the device. The device is, is still today not, the penetration is still quite low. It's bulky. It's heavy. Uh, it can remove makeup.

It can mess up with your hair, and it's not very... I mean, it's not very good yet.

[chuckles] I mean, it's just the beginning of those devices and headsets, and they're already like, it's, it's a technological marvel when you think about the Apple Vision Pro or the Meta Quest. Uh,

you like one, you prefer the other, that's fine. That's not even the debate. Both are just technological marvels. But it's still also the beginning.

And, and, and as a result, yes, it's good, but if you wear it too long or it can still have some, um, and it's super costly too. So the penetration, when you talk about, you know, our customer base, they're not equipped.

So the main challenge, the, the second challenge, uh, beyond just being very clear on why we're doing this, the second one was how to bring this to our customers to be true to our DNA around accessibility.

And that's why we decided to, one, have a, a, a website-based experience and a desktop and mobile accessible, uh, experience.

So you go to a website, you enter the, the, the, the, the address, and then you just log in, and you play.

Regardless of your, um, computer, uh, it's streamed to your, uh, computer, so you don't need any, you know, um, uh, graphic power unit or, uh, expensive, uh, computer.

It just runs on any machine, and it also runs on your phone, uh, regardless of your phone. And so that was very important to us.

But that was also a challenge because then how can this be immersive if we remove the headset? Everyone was super convinced about, yeah, it's amazing. I'm surrounded by cool stuff.

But how this will translate into a flat screen was, was a big challenge, and it's still a challenge today to, at some point, because the user interaction, the, the gameplay, and the, the immersiveness is for sure not-- I mean, it's different.

So there are tons of gamers that play and that are very immersed in their game and could spend hours playing, so it's not necessarily that it's less interesting. It's just different. So there was a challenge there.

I think those were the main two, yeah. Mm-hmm. Uh, two follow-up questions on, on that. You talked about, uh, KPIs, uh, uh, that you measure. Can you tell us a little bit about what KPIs you looked at? Sure.

And, and before I do that, one, one additional challenge, uh, we had is, uh, is, um, a capability challenge.

Internally at Sephora, we didn't have people familiar with Web3, with 3D, with immersive experiences, um, with avatars, with-- I mean, we're not equipped. We don't have people,

you know, that is-- that's not how we operate. So the challenge was to find the right capabilities and the right partners. And, and that was a challenge also at the time because that was a very nascent industry.

And we came up, I think, with the best, um, the best combination of niche startups,

very expert, very good at what they do, very agile, and well-known big names, strategic partners of, of Sephora that know us well and that can support and, and, and, and structure those, those type of work. And, and

to set that up, to identify the, the capabilities and, and to structure, uh, from a project management perspective, this was, was of course a challenge.

And I, and I think it's important to, to add to the, to the previous question. Uh, now in terms of, in terms of KPIs,

um, what we're measuring through this experience is the level of engagement, so how much time people spend, the level of interaction and, and, and, um, actual fun. So are people playing?

Are they completing the quest? Are they talking to each other? Are they clicking on objects? Are they launching the videos, et cetera? Um, and then we're measuring the level of satisfaction.

So we sent a survey to all participants asking them very frankly and, and, and, you know, honestly, what did you think about it? Do you want to see it more? Do you want to have more experiences? Was it fun?

Was it interesting?

And, and, and that was very, very interesting to us to, of course, to get the results because it was not only quantitative, like on a scale of one to 10, but we also asked real questions like, "Okay, tell us about your experience."

Uh, and, uh, on, on those three elements, uh, engagement, uh, satisfaction and, and, and, uh, and interaction, um, it was-- the key learnings are, the learnings are just, just amazing.

Um- Well, what are some of those, those key learnings? Or is, is there something you could, you could share with us or- Yeah, what I can share is-... something that was surprising? Yeah. I mean,

what I can share is, is the fact that there, there is, uh, there is interest, there is definitely curiosity around discovering products, brands.

Um, you know, we created those amazing branded spaces for Givenchy, for Guerlain, for Make Up For Ever, for Sephora Collection, and they were all bespoke.

And so just, just exploring, discovering those spaces, fully branded, beautiful, um, it was just already a good experience. So there is interest and, and, and willingness to discover.

People walked, people spent time and, and, and so that was already a, a good win. The second learning is the fact that people, uh, want to see more. Uh, they want to see more.

They, they want also to, to, [lips smack] um, to be able to, uh, make the bridge between this digital world and also the real world.

And, and, but that seems quite-- That was not that surprising, right?

When you, when you play, when you discover a brand that you know that is sold at Sephora, you, you kind of want to have, um, either a reward or an access or a sample, something that is tied to a, a real life benefit.

Even though, you know, everyone was super happy with the customization of their avatar, uh, you know, putting, putting makeup style, putting, uh, clothes, et cetera.

And the fact that they won some digital rewards was also quite nice. You know, you, you could actually display the fact that you've done the, the, this experience, et cetera.

I wouldn't-- Of course, I, on purpose, I don't go into too many details around those learnings because we, we, um, you know, we invested a lot of time, effort, uh, in, into building this to get to those learnings. Um,

but there's nothing that surprising in what I just said, meaning that in my opinion, uh, the world is marching towards more and more immersive experiences. The content is set to be more and more immersive.

Before in social network were just, you know, plain text. Now it's videos, it's sound, it's, and tomorrow it's gonna be GenAI, it's gonna be integration of reality and f- and fiction.

It is getting-- We're getting there, right? The f- the fact that 3D will be more and more, uh, present is, is just a no-brainer. Um,

the fact that it can apply to beauty is, is maybe a l- a learning, but that's not that surprising either.

Um, so yeah, I mean, for sure at Sephora we will continue and we're continuing to, to explore, um, because when you talk about immersive experiences, what we did with this launch, uh, earlier this year was one attempt, was one, um Um, one way to do it, right?

There are many devices, there are many ways to do it. It can be event-based, it can be on a smartphone, it can be using virtual reality, it said it can be in-store on a big screen, it can be many, many things. Um, so,

uh, the interesting part is how do you integrate those experiences within your customer journey?

How do you bring this to life, uh, whether you're at home, whether you're on, you're on a, your daily commute, whether you are in the store actually looking for additional information or playing a game, and it's really about how at any time

or anywhere, uh, you can have a good time, uh, with your favorite beauty brand. Mm-hmm. That's, uh, a, a very good segue. We're already almost at the end of the show.

Uh, Vincent, I would love to ask you the last question before we jump into a very, very quick lightning round.

Uh, last question, what's next for consumer brands in, in Web3 and w- where especially focusing on, on beauty brands? Where do you see the space going in the next couple of years?

I see first a good thing is, is this speculative phase around these technologies is, um, I mean, I wouldn't, I wouldn't say-- I, I cannot say over, but at least there's been some, um, cleanup, I would say, and, and that's good.

That's a good news. Actually, now we're really focusing on what Web3 can deliver and, and the value I'm, I, I keep on talking about. Um, so that's good.

Where this is going, I, I do believe that the sense of, uh, community membership and the b- the bridging the gap between digital and, and, and real life is gonna be, uh, even more present, meaning that you own stuff in the digital world that would enable things in the real world and vice versa.

And this is, is, is going to become, uh, personal opinion, but, but, uh, more and more present. Um, we as brands, I think needs to be-- we need to be careful not to isolate people.

This remains very, very niche, and this should not become, uh, something that is not inclusive.

So the notion of inclusivity around those technology is, uh, should and is a key element, uh, for brands to think about so that not just technical elite can benefit from those technologies, can benefit from the rewards that brands, you know, uh, attach to, uh, to, to the people owning those, those, uh, those tokens, et cetera.

There are many great communities, by the way, that are, uh, spreading the, the W- Web3 technology, encouraging people to try and test, uh, thinking about World of Women that we collaborated with, uh, for, for the launch of, of Sephora Universe.

There are many others. [lip smack] Um, so that to me is, is something super important that we should all keep in mind. Um, and then Web3

around, uh, uh, traceability is also definitely a, a, a use case super interesting that is explored by other, uh, companies. For Sephora, w- it's a bit early for us.

Uh, d- really depends on the, on the nature of, of the product that you, you, you distribute.

Um, but I think there is definitely a use case there, uh, driving, you know, confidence, uh, trust in such a, a, um, digital world where everything can, could be, uh, falsified or misused or...

So I think bringing authenticity and trust and, and, and traceability in the digital world is, is very much, uh, uh, needed.

But that's something, you know, as, as, as being part of Sephora, I'm, I'm less confident to talk about, but I do personally believe that Web3 can, can answer and address some of those, um, uh, problematic.

And, and then, uh, a last warning is, is around, again, the value, and, and the value not to just do things because we have got a cool technology, but to try to, to answer some of the most important, uh, problems.

Mm-hmm. That's, uh, very interesting, Vincent. I could, uh, keep talking with you about that for hours. Uh, we unfortunately didn't have enough time today. Um, well, thank you. My light just, just shut off, so- Yeah.

[chuckles]... perfect, perfect timing. Exactly. I would, I would be glad to stay as well, and, and I wanted to- Yeah... to thank you for, for, for this opportunity- Yep... Marc. Yeah. Th- thank you, Vincent.

And, and just before we, we end the show, I would like to, uh, do a two-minute lightning round. Okay. Those are, uh, very brief questions and one-word answers. Okay. Um, should also a little bit, bit, bit of fun.

Um, we'll start with the first one. Uh, the first app you check in the morning? Oh, it's a tough one, uh, because it-- I tend, I try not to actually look at my phone when I wake up.

Uh, the more, the, the, the, the older I get, the, the, the later I want to look at my f- I would say I would check my mails, emails. Okay. Makeup for men, yes or no? Not for me. Physical store or virtual world shopping?

Physical store. Not virtual world shopping. I think virtual world discovery is great. Shopping, I would go to a real store. Mm-hmm. What's one book everyone should read?

Uh, "Reinventing the Wheel," and I don't remember the name of the author. Uh, it was, it was a great read for me. Yeah, we're gonna link it in the show notes. What's the biggest opportunity of Web3, in one word? Wow.

Um, independence. What's the biggest myth about Web3? Money.

And last one, uh, something you would like to tell our listeners, uh, could be anything that might be interested in that topic, that think about entering Web3. Explore and, and be humble. Um,

uh, a lot of time I had to, to really be very humble because you, you think you know, you actually don't know everything. [chuckles] So it's, those two picks are quite, quite big. But explore. Yeah.

That's a, a great ending. Um, so Vincent, again, thank you very much for coming on the show. If you like this, you can, uh, comment it, you can li- uh, you can repost it, share it with your friends.

You can find us on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, and YouTube. Um, Vincent, where can people find you and find out more about Sephora Universe? I'm gonna sound like a boomer. I don't have Instagram.

[chuckles] I, I tend to stay away from social network. Can, can be weird, but actually I think I, I've, I've found the right balance between virtual and, and, and real life, and I think this is very important to me.

People can find me on LinkedIn, uh, with my first name, last name. I- I've got a lot of inbox, uh, email inbox, but I tend to, to, to reply as much as I can, so people can find me easily on LinkedIn. Perfect.

Thank you, Vincent, very much for coming, and, uh, all the best for your future endeavors at Sephora and with Sephora Universe, and see you soon. Thank you. Thank you very much, Marc. It was a pleasure.

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